Episode 83: How to Grow Your Business to 7 or 8 Figures with These Mindset Changes & Systems with Shahrez Hayder

March 9, 2021

In this episode, Shahrez D. Hayder shares how he helps businesses grow to seven or eight figures by creating systems and exactly how to do it, plus, the mindset changes he had to make to get where he is today and how you can too! We also talked about the importance of third-party validation, and how getting in big publications can make a real difference.

Resources mentioned

Contact information:
@shahrezhayder on Instagram.

3 Key Points

Mindset changes lead to massive business growth.

It’s important to elimination, automate, delegate in that order.

Third-party validation in publications is huge for more credibility and authority.


Hi and welcome to Episode 83. Today my guest is Shahrez Hader. Shahrez is a CEO and founder of Hayder Enterprises. The King of Systems is known to build eight-figure businesses from scratch. He’s developed indestructible systems through advanced,  business marketing strategy and applied psychology. The second he and his team step in, they completely re-engineered sales, marketing, and branding systems in order to turn the miserable bottleneck-filled venture into a revenue-generating machine. Plus, Shahrez has powerful network connections and lands businesses on authoritative publications like Forbes, Entrepreneur, and Inc. Shahrez also holds exclusive coaching sessions and masterminds for entrepreneurs who are looking to scale their business and optimize their mindset to the next level. So, Hi Shiraz. Welcome to the call.

Shahrez:  Hey. Ellen. How are you?

Ellen: I’m good. How are you?

Shahrez: I’m great. It’s nice to be here.

[01:49] Ellen: Yeah, I’m excited,  I always say that I’m excited. I’m excited a lot. Yeah. We met on Facebook and you found me.

Shahrez:  Yeah.

Ellen: And we started talking, and so you have some interesting things going on that I think people should know about. So, why don’t you start by telling us a little bit about your background.

[02:13] Shahrez: Yeah. So, I mean, you know the name; my name is Shahrez Hayder. Great introduction. So yes, I call myself a business engineer because I engineer businesses. And it’s a very interesting term just because there’s a lot of people out there that they’re like, they call themselves “serial entrepreneurs “or, stuff like that. I don’t really like that term. I think that what we do, especially, or people like myself and, you know, I can talk about a few people that I know who are notable names that do the same things that I would do; we engineer, right? We put systems together and we put these processes together that really make the bandwidth of a business explode so that you can really scale it to any level. And that’s really, you look at  these businesses like Apple and Google and Facebook and there’s so many of these businesses. The reason why they’re so successful and the reason why they can be billion-dollar businesses or trillion-dollar businesses is because they were engineered in a way to be able to handle that bandwidth. Right?

[03:25] Ellen: Right.

Shahrez: So,  that’s why I like to call myself a business engineer, because I love to engineer the businesses in a way where it can handle more bandwidth. Right? It’s like engineering a plane that can fly higher and further distances or engineering, a car that can go faster, right? Or, go slower or have more people in it. So, that’s why I like the term business engineer. But yeah, other than that, my background… I never went to college, never went to university, actually, that would be a little bit of a lie because I did go to college for a few days before dropping out. But yeah, didn’t go to college. I didn’t go to university. I graduated from high school and yeah, just got right into business, but it wasn’t all sunshine cupcakes and rainbows butterflies in the beginning.

Ellen: Right, it never is.

Shahrez:  But through failure, and experiences,  and learning from great people alongside my mistakes, I was able to produce seven-figure businesses, and then obviously consultant eight-figure businesses.

[04:35] Ellen: Yeah. So, what was the thing that turned the switch for you? You know, like from the failure to suddenly getting to this? I shouldn’t say suddenly, but getting to the success, was there something particular or how did that happen?

[04:50] Shahrez: Yeah, the biggest thing that really changed my mindset was belief. In this world, we’re all born, really equal even there’s some people they say, “Okay, yeah. There’s people that are born with disabilities and stuff like that.” Even to that, I say, “No, we’re born equal because there’s always equal opportunity. You’re born with a clean slate,” right? You’re born sinless; you’ve done nothing wrong. Right? You’ve done really nothing good. So, it’s all about how you’re nurtured over time, right?

Ellen: Yes.

Shahrez: By the age of seven, our subconscious mind picks up all these things and they collect these beliefs. Now, obviously, some people learn quicker. Some people learn slower. Some people absorb information differently. Some people are book smart. Some people are street-smarts, some people are athletic. Some people, like there’s really different types of things. Now, the thing is my belief system, when I first came into entrepreneurship was “Yes, I can do this.”

[05:53] Shahrez: And that’s why I dropped out of school. And I’m like, “You know what? I can do this.” But my belief system in order to actually build something that I’m proud of, was not there. And that’s what I didn’t realize for like the first year is that I would call myself an entrepreneur. I would call myself a business owner. I would call myself all these things. But that was because that’s who I wanted to be. I wasn’t really that there yet because what I realized is that an entrepreneur has a different belief system than the average person. And you have to really get rid of a lot of in order to actually create those belief systems.  And here are the belief systems that I really think that changed me. And the first one is, is really just taking imperfect action. Yeah. Right. You know, I talked to my team all the time and I’m like, “Done is better than perfect.”

[06:45]: You know, they’re sitting there. It’s like, “Yeah, we should plan this out.” I’m like, “No, get it done. Bring it back to me. I’ll give you some feedback. And then, we move from there.” And there’s something called “the feedback loop”.,I’ll talk about that a little bit. But imperfect actions, number one, done better than perfect. Number two, if he can do it, I could do it. Right? That’s another thing. Right? You see all these people online, nobody’s talking about what they’re doing wrong in this world and nobody’s talking about their failures. Right? Everybody wants to gloat. Right? And that’s how they make more money. Right? It’s like, “Oh yeah, I made a hundred thousand dollars this month.” Right? Or, “A hundred thousand dollars this year. Wow.” Right? You go on Facebook, Instagram, you see those types of posts.

[07:22]: You’re like, “Ah, I should be doing that.” But what you shouldn’t be thinking is “Okay, if he can do, I can do it too.”All right. And that brings me to my third belief, which is an abundance mindset. Right? The fact that you should know that there’s a lot of money out there in circulation and that it’s not going anywhere. Right? The only thing that’s going somewhere is your time. And if you spend your time thinking about the wrong things, then there’s something that’s actually scarce, but money is not scarce. Money’s being printed every single day. Right?

So, people need to realize that thing as well. And that’s one thing that changed for me is that abundance mindset. Okay, cool. There’s a lot of money out there that can be made. The other thing. Then it comes to the fifth belief. Right? Hopefully. I’m an order right now, yeah,  five. So,the fifth belief would be, you actually have to care about your clients and you have to solve real problems. It’s not about the money. So, once you get to the point of actually the abundance mindset and the abundance belief, it goes to, “Okay, now I have to think about a problem that needs to be solved.” Right? I have to.

[08:32]Ellen: Yeah, And I see a lot of people kind of get caught in their own problems, what they need, what they’re thinking, what feels good to them. And they don’t think enough about the clients.

Shahrez: Exactly. And that’s the biggest thing is, and that I would say is the fifth. And last, is you got to have a problem and it’s all about the clients, right? If you can actually solve the right problems and lose sleep over your clients, and you’re going to be extremely, extremely successful, because now you’re not chasing the money, you’re creating a magnet for clients to come to you because now you’re centered around clients. And that’s like the Amazon approach.

So, those are the belief systems that really changed it for me. And once I was able to implement all of those, it was just drastic just starting taking action, starting to really believe in the abundance mindset. Right? It’s starting to solve real problems. Those things that really changed things for me.

[09:31] Ellen: What was it like? Rlike the minute, like you heard that and then a switch flipped, or was it like a gradual kind of coming to terms with things?

[09:41] Shahrez: Do you think was more a flip of the switch? It was really, it was like one day, and I was telling somebody this story actually today is I was chilly on top of a rock. And this rock’s about ten feet- twenty-feet high. I don’t really know. It was really high. I was looking down at it and I was saying, “Okay, cool. So ,I’m looking down at the ground and it’s really, really high. And the average person would sit there and think it’s like, “’Okay, that’s really high. I don’t want to jump.” Right?

Ellen:  Right.

Shahrez: And what I primed my mind to do, and that’s the first thing is taking the imperfect action is to just jump without thinking. And the biggest thing there is, obviously you don’t want to think, you don’t want to act before thinking, because I was primed by my dad to always think before acting. Right? The biggest thing is you got to calculate what is the worst that can happen in this situation really, really fast? Okay. And in my mind, it’s like, “Okay, the worst thing happen is I land all right. It hurts my knees a little bit. I might not be able to walk for two weeks. If I break my legs, I won’t be able to walk for two months.” That’s something that could live by. Right? It’s okay.

But if I don’t jump right now, I’m going to call myself a wuss because I didn’t jump ,and I didn’t take the action. So, what I did was I just closed my eyes and I’m jumped off. Right? And I jumped off and I landed, it hurt my knees a little bit. But after that, it was completely fine. And it’s crazy because somebody who would overthink the situation probably would overthink it and not taking the action. And that’s what we see in business all the time. They overthink the consequences or they overthink the success. Right? People are afraid of success.

[11:17] Ell”en: Yes, yes. I’ve had people say that to me. “Well, what happens if it takes off…if the book takes off and I’ll say, “Look, first of all, people think that the book’s just going to sell itself.” Right? And I’ll say to them, “No, you have to market it. So, if you start feeling uncomfortable and you just can’t handle it, stop marketing, nothing will happen.”

Shahrez: Exactly. Exactly. And that’s what they do. So, it’s just like maybe the rock example, that’s my example. But it’s like the same thing. You’re standing at the edge of a cliff and you’re about to dive into the ocean. What are you going to do? You’re going to think about all the possible things that can go wrong or all the possible things that can go right, but either way you’re comfortable to standing there nothing’s happened. That’s the life of the entrepreneur that isn’t going to be successful, who sits there and thinks, thinks, thinks, thinks, thinks, thinks, thinks and doesn’t really take the action. And that’s the one thing that I had to learn the hard way for literally sitting there thinking my way to actually stressing myself out. So, when I jumped off, it was like, “Whoa,” like that’s, you know, whatever I thought that the worst was going to happen actually didn’t happen. Right? So, that’s the biggest thing. And then once that took off, it was like, everything else, once you start taking action, everything else kind of falls in the abundance mindset, solving the right problems. Like all these things, they really just come into place. Right?

[12:38] Ellen: Yes and no. So, I’ll share my experience. So, I actually was one of those people like   you, I thought “I can do this.” When I first found books and I thought “Not only can I do this, I can do this better than what’s out there.” Cause it was sad at that point in 2004. And so, I had a mentor, Alex Mandossian,  and the big thing right back then was Teleseminar Secrets. And I learned how to do that- how to do teleseminars and make money doing it and all that. And it worked for a few years until the recession hit. And the problem was that I hadn’t learned the basics of business. I learned one strategy. And so, when that stopped working, it got difficult, number one. Number two, I did three summits before people even called them summits.

[13:29]: And I did really well. One of them, I made $16,000. One of them, I made $20,000, the third one, we lost money because the whole thing had changed. Like it had gone from people paying quite a bit of money to go to them, to them more being free. And then, if they wanted the videos, and we didn’t understand that it changed at that time. But the main thing that happened was over time doing those launches over and over and over, it was exhausting. And so eventually, what happened for me was I became afraid of taking the action again, not because I didn’t know what was going to happen, but because I knew what was going to happen, I knew it would be exhausting. I knew it would be chaotic because I know things always go wrong with technology. And so, I didn’t start out afraid, but at some point I became afraid.

[14:14]: So I mean, that’s a very different scenario, but sometimes I’ll see on Twitter where people will say, “Oh, just do it for six months and you’ll never have to worry and make money.” Well, that’s not necessarily true. You have to be doing the right things. You have to understand that the market’s always changing. You have to continue to learn, and you have to get to the point where, and this was the other thing I didn’t understand back then, which I totally get now, and it’s from experience and having good mentors, is there’s no such thing as failure, right? That you either learn a lesson or you succeed. But if you keep doing the same thing over and over, and you’re not getting good mentors and you’re not getting good information, and you’re also not in touch with your inner guides to know what’s right for you, you can keep doing things that are not going to get you anywhere for a long time.

[15:00]: So, eventually what happened for me was I knew what it was going to be like. And I knew I wasn’t going to like it, but I also knew that if I didn’t do it anyway, what was the alternative? Right? It’s like either you’re going to quit or you’re going to take action ‘cause you don’t want to sit here anymore doing neither. So, that’s what I did. So, eventually I got back in the game, but what I had to do was get my head to that place where it’s like, “Okay, these are my choices and I’m not willing to get out, so  I’m going to do what it takes, even though I know I’m not going to be happy in the short term (launching them, not the teaching, which I love),” like I’m happy when the long-term doing launches, but in the short term to me, they suck. And that’s how I feel about them,

Shahrez: 100%,

[15:46] Ellen: And then the other thing is what really helped me also was taking Jeff Walker’s Product Launch Formula because it was very comforting to me when somebody said, “Look, this is hard. It’s hard. It’s not easy.” I thought I was doing something wrong ‘cause I thought it was hard. It’s like, “No, it’s a lot of work.”

Shahrez: Yeah. But one thing that I’m really interested in with you is  I want to learn more about what you were talking about the bottleneck ventures and getting it into a system. So, what are some of the tips or some of the things people can look for that are going to help them to re-engineer and do it better? Is there something you can tell us about that? And then I want to talk about magazines.

[16:28] Shahrez: Yeah, for sure. We’ll definitely get to the magazines, but yeah, when it comes to the systems, I feel like the biggest thing…so, systems are all about macros first. All right?

Ellen: Okay.

Shahez: And that’s the thing that people have to understand is that yeah…

Ellen: They want to get into minutia.

Shahrez: Yeah. They want to get into this whole system game, and they want to build an expandable business and a scalable business and increase the bandwidth of the business, but they’re so focused on the macros. And yes, it starts with the macros, but you can’t neglect the micros. So, the macros would obviously be elimination, automation and delegation for the steps you have to take to systemize, but then also the macros would also be client acquisition, and then you have client onboarding, and then you have client fulfillment, and then you have client retention. Right? And then on top of that, you have systems for your company culture as well, which is like a whole different thing.

[17:29]: Right? So like, there’s so much that goes into it. But I feel like the biggest thing that people have to understand is that it starts with the elimination, automation, delegation, you got to eliminate all the. Right? That’s the number one thing when it comes to building any system. The first thing you got to do inside your business is go in there and see like, “Okay, cool. Am I doing any extra steps that are causing me to do more work or causing my team to do more?” For example, yesterday I was talking to one of my team members and he was saying, “Okay, why don’t we convert something into a video, into an actual video file before sending it as a link? Right? And I’m like, “Why would you convert a shareable link into a video before sending it off?” That’s an extra step, right?

Because now you’ve got to go to the link, the links already shareable, by the way, so, you can send the link to somebody. So, it’s like a Panda doc or it’s like a YouTube link. Okay. So,  basically let me break it down for you. And like anybody who’s hearing, this is like, okay, if you have a YouTube video that has a link, what are you going to do? You’re going to send the link in order to share. But in this case, what he wanted to do was he went to download the video and send out the video instead. Right? And I said, “That’s an extra step. We can’t do that.” Right? So, that’s one example of elimination. Another example of elimination is having team meetings when you don’t need to have team meetings. Right?

Ellen:  Right.

Shahrez: All right. You’re going to have a team meeting when you can just send an email out that’s elimination. Right? Another step of elimination is “Okay, cool. I need to check every like,” Okay, we have a PR business. For example, I need to check every single article before it goes, no, why don’t I train somebody on how to check the article? So, I’m going to eliminate myself from that process. That’s comes into delegation too. But if you’re not going to eliminate something and there’s always going to be an elimination factor there, you’re going to have to simplify. Right? And that’s the biggest thing. If you can eliminate, you’re going to simplify the process to the best of your ability.

And if you can’t simplify, then you’re going to go ahead and automate that process. And if you can’t automate the process, you’re going to go ahead and delegate it. Delegation is the last step. Never hire somebody like a staff member or never hire a team member if you don’t need to. If it can be done through computers, do it through computers. You’ve seen it in McDonald’s. They actually rolled out those computerized employees like this touchscreens where you can order. Right? So now, they’re saving a whole bunch of money on payroll because they’re able to automate some of the process,

[20:02] Ellen: Right. I mean, some of what are they called? the projections to all these jobs are going to be lost to artificial intelligence.

Shahrez: Exactly. A lot of these jobs are going to be lost to artificial intelligence because people are getting better at the automation aspect. Right? In the beginning, it used to just be elimination. And there was a little bit of automation. There was mostly delegation. “Okay, cool. Like we have a problem. It’s hire somebody for it.” Now. It’s like, “Okay, we have a problem. Okay. Do we even need this problem? Is this problem. Is that even something that it shouldn’t be affecting us? Okay, cool. If it should be affecting us and we do need to solve this problem, let’s look to automate the problem first. Can we create a sequence on an app like Zapier or integromat or any sort of automation software and get that sequence made out,”right? “If not, okay, we need to delegate it.” And you know, people would always say, “Okay, now hire this person, hire this person.”

[20:51]: Well, it costs like a hundred dollars a month for a software. People look at that as expensive. It’s really not. When you’re going to hire somebody on payroll for anywhere between $500 to $2,000, depending on what that seed is. And sometimes, you’re going to hire people upwards of $5,000 to a $10,000 seat. If you’re hiring local in the first-world country; like that’s a lot of money right there. So building smart systems is a lot better than building, going through those macros. Now here’s the part where people tend to really mess us up. They look at those macros, the elimination, the automation, can automation, delegation, but they don’t look at the micros. Okay, cool. So, I’m delegating. You’re not going to solve the problem by just hiring somebody. I have this one friend, I’m not going to say his name or anything. Right?

But he, he delegates and he sucks at it so bad to the point where he calls me. He’s like, “Dude, like I need help.” So, what I did was I brought him into our company as like a tourist, all right, cool. So he’s going through our Zoom meetings. He’s going through everything. And he’s like, “Bro, your team’s unbelievable. How did you get them trained like that?” It’s because I focused on the micros of delegation. Now the micro is a delegation are two things you need to delegate fast and quick. And then another one is culture. Culture is a whole system in its own. I don’t want to get too deep into culture by fast.

Ellen: Well, what do you mean by fast?

Shahrez? So, it’s like, okay, for example, the biggest problem with most entrepreneurs, especially the ones that are okay, go-getters. “like I got to do everything by myself”. They don’t delegate fast enough.

[22:19]: They don’t fast enough. And what happens is they’re scared. They’re like, “What if this goes wrong?”No,what do I do, if somebody comes up to me and says, “Okay, would this needs to be done?” I’m like, “Okay, cool, do it,” like no instruction. “Yeah, go do it. If you mess up, you know, come ask me.” Okay, cool. “So, do it.” They bring it back to me. And this is something called the “feedback loop”. So, I’m going to introduce this. So, this is the best way to delegate by far, one delegate fast. Okay, cool. Something needs to be done. All right. Team member comes up to you and says, “Okay, this really needs to be done. “Like we’re receiving your problem here.” “Okay, cool. so, why don’t you do that?”

[22:54] Ellen: What about when you’re hiring.

Shahrez:  When you’re hiring?

Ellen: You’re talking about people that are already on your team.

Shahrez: Okay. So, when you’re hiring, the biggest thing would be to look for character, hire, hire character and train skill. And a lot of people disagree with me on this and I’ve actually gone into quite, you know, some…

Ellen: No, that’s pretty much what I’ve read was…

Shahrez: Yeah.

Ellen: Yeah.

[23:12] Shahrez: Sometimes people are like, “Hey, like, we should hire somebody qualified so they can work right off the bat.” Well, you know what, Mr Qualified, when they find a better gig, they’re leaving because they don’t have the character. And they’re going based off of skill. Right? If you want to long-term employees, long-term business, hire character and train skill.

So, the biggest thing is I’ll hire somebody who’s amazing. They have amazing character. They have music where work ethic. They want to learn. They’re driven. I’ll invest in them for like two to three months. And that’s an employee for like five to ten years, even more. But if I just hire a contract right out the bat or hire employee that’s like costs me five grand a month on a big retainer. And all of a sudden market value goes up and they’re like, “Oh, I’m big shot. I already know how to do. I came in here working right off the bat.” They’re either demanding a higher salary or they’re leaving you. Right? So, that’s the biggest thing with just hiring’ it’s conduct a lot of interviews and hire character and train skill.

[24:06] Ellen: Yeah. I want to interrupt you for a second on this. When you were talking about delegating, what are the issues with this that I encountered was not being really clear about what your zone of genius is, and then doing things that you shouldn’t be doing and things that you should be automating and delegating and all that. So next week, that’s what I’m going to talk about. I’m going to talk about finding your zone of genius and how to stay there, so that everything that Shahrez is telling you is going to make more sense, because there’s another piece to it.

[24:44] Shahrez:  Oh, 100%. Yeah. So, back to the delegating thing, especially,  is like the feedback loop is extremely important. So, you’re going to delegate fast. You throw something at somebody. And the biggest thing you had to say to them is, “Listen, go do it, get it done, bring it back to me. I’ll check it out. If it’s bad, cool. I’ll give you some feedback on it. And then you do it until it’s good.” And what that does is increases the confidence of one, the employee. It tells them to step out of their comfort zone, and it removes you from the process. It removes the thinking, “Okay, cool. This has to be perfect.” No, people are smart too. I made a video about this recently as well. You got to hire people and act like the dumbest person in the room. You have to act like you don’t know how to do anything.

[25:20]: All you have to do is manage people and be like, “Listen, go do it,” right? “Cool. You don’t know how to do a Google. It, Google has all the answers. Why do I have to give you the answers?” They come back. They give you the thing. And it’s actually really good. And I’ve learned that that’s a really good way to do it.

And now there’s another principle that I learned. And I forgot where I learned it from. It was a book, right? It was actually a book summary that I learned on YouTube. And this is, this comes back to, you know, implementing fast. Every time I listened to a book summary, I implement it right away. And basically, what it was is bandwidth, increasing the bandwidth of your employees and team members. So what you’re going to do is when you delegate, you’re going to toss them task after task, after task, until they mess up.

[25:59]: So, say you gave them ten tasks and they finally messed up. They finally gave you some garbage back in your feedback loop. Now what you’re going to do is you’re going to split that in half. All right? And now they’re going to have five tasks, and now you’re going to keep ramping it up until they mess up again. And what usually happens, even in our company, we’ve tracked. This is that once we cut it off at ten, and it goes back to five, they go back up to twelve. Then we go bring it back to six, and then they bring it back to twenty. And now we’re bringing it back to ten. And all of a sudden they’re able to handle like twenty-five tasks a day…

Ellen: Oh nice.

Shahrez: As superstars. And basically, the concept behind this is… it’s the same thing as weightlifting. You know, anybody here lift weights? They go bench, press a hundred pounds.

[26:40]: Okay. Now the a hundred pounds heavy. Take it off. Now you bench at fifty, it feels like lightweight. Okay, cool. Now your body’s getting used to it. It’s building that muscle back up and now it could bench press one-twenty. Take cool. Now that’s too heavy. I’m going back down. And then all of a sudden you’re able to bench press 200- twice the weight you were initially able to handle. That’s the same thing in your delegation. So, that’s what it is. Right?

Ellen: How interesting.

Shahrez: And when you’re able to delegate crazy fast and then implement those types of systems Microsystems, and those are the Microsystems I’m telling you about. And I feel like I don’t articulate it well enough. I think I articulate it a little bit better in my videos, in my programs. Right?

But the macro would be delegation and the micro would be the small little systems I just told you about delegate fast, right? The delegation system, I just told you, give him, I don’t know what it’s called, but you give them ten tasks, you split and a half, and then you increase their bandwidth. Right? And also the culture team meetings, right? Having Slack channels for your delegation, or having a sauna boards for your delegation, different things. And that’s what will make the difference. It’s all about the micros. It’s not even about the macro. Anybody can open up a book and read about the macros. Right?

[27:44] Ellen: Right. Well, I mean, that’s great because I love when I listened to people and everybody contributes something that maybe I haven’t heard before or heard in exactly that way so it makes a lot of sense. But let’s move on and let’s talk about how did you get into the publications? Let’s talk about that.

[28:01] Shahrez: Yeah. The publication that’s actually very, very interesting. So the publications, it was actually, I was actually working on a content system. Now this is where systems and publications kind of came in. I was working on my content system and I’m like, “Okay, cool. So, how can I build a content system to nurture my audience?” Right? Long-term, make people know, like, and trust me and be that go-to figure in my industry. And what I learned is that your content isn’t enough. Anybody can sit there and make content, but third-party validation is the biggest thing, right? If you can get on Forbes or Inc or Entrepreneur, Yahoo, finance, or ABC, Fox anywhere, really. So, third-party validation. That’s the biggest thing. If you get featured on Forbes or Inc, or Entrepreneur, Yahoo, Finance, or ABC ,Fox, really anywhere, we have 300 different publications that we work with.

[28:49]: And what I realized is if you can get other people telling you’re the best, you’re going to be the best, right? Because you’re not saying it, they are. And that’s the biggest thing. So, I thought about that. I’m like, “You know what, I want to get featured on these publications.” So, I went to some PR agencies and I tried to get some prices and the prices were really ridiculous. These guys were upcharging it like no tomorrow. And I’m like, “Okay, there has to be a better way.” So, I went and built my own connections and I spent a good few months doing that. And I got my connections to Forbes and Inc, and Yahoo Finance, and really every single publication that we have within those months. And I really did it for a selfish reason for myself. I’m like, “I want to do it for myself.“

Ellen: Sometimes, that’s the way it happens.

Shahrez: Yeah, exactly. So, I wanted to put that in my content system to be “Okay if I could get all these things at cost, that’s going to be able to ramp up my business.” Now, what I realize is that this is something that everybody needs, but what if we can bring that solution to the market, but not charge people crazy prices. Right?

[29:53] Ellen:  Yeah. I thought some people were paying like a hundred-thousand dollars or something to say that they’re an ABC and NBC and all that. Right?

Exactly, exactly. We’re a fraction of that. And that’s how I feel like it should be because the PR game’s all about relationships. And that’s what I love doing building relationships. And it’s allowed me to really build relationships with industry giants and not even industry giants, but even like smaller, I would say the smaller giants who are trying to become those industry giants. Right?

And once I did it for that selfish reason, I did it for so many selfless reasons. In fact, I haven’t even published myself in so many publications. I published people in a way more publication that I publish myself, just because  I said, ”You know what? This is an amazing business that I want to build.” And here we are, we have 300-plus publications that we work with. I’ve gotten people into Forbes, Entrepreneur, Inc, all the publications I’ve talked to you about, Yahoo Finance, we have a Yahoo Top 10 you know, contract as well that we work with. Right? Then it’s just amazing what we do here.

[30:51] Ellen: That is so awesome. So, for people who are looking to get more credibility and I have to say, I mean, that is huge. I was very lucky early on, Suzanne Evans created this award called the Be The Change Award and she gave it to me. And so, then I was able to say, “I’m an award-winning coach” pretty early on. And it makes a difference, and then every other accolade that you grow on top of it, it just keeps adding up and adding up and gives you more credibility and more authority and gets you into more places too. You know? So having that, and then combining that with the book is really amazing. And then, you go out and you speak and really the sky’s the limit.

Shahrez:  Oh yeah. Oh yeah. And PR is it’s third-party validation. So, it’s just amazing to be able to promote any product or book, like you said, with somebody else telling the world about it.

[31:50] Ellen: Right., right. Well, do you have any final tips before we go?

Shahrez: Yeah. My final tip is systems save lives, right?

Ellen: Yeah.

Shahrez: It’s so it’s so important. And another thing is, don’t worry too much about the systems going in. The biggest newbie, move in the game and I’ve made this mistake myself. That’s why I can like talk about it, but I hear it so much. I get calls from people. I get messages from people. How do I build a passive income stream? How do I do this? If you’re going to focus on the passive income stream, you should not build a business because the business it’s not passive.

The easiest way to make money is go get a nine to five. You have very stable, very secure income business will give you fourteen hours a day, eighty- hours a week. You’re going to be hustling and be grinding. Right? And that’s the thing. So, the biggest newbie mistake is focusing on that passive, you should focus on taking action, getting cash through the door, solving a problem, actually seeing if people are willing to pay for it, and then building a system around that, that’s your first move. Right? And that’s my biggest tip is

“Okay, cool. so I have an idea.” That’s great. You know you’ll often see Shark Tank, right? You know, the show (inaudible) capitalists, like Mark Cuban, Kevin O’Leary, these guys come in and they’re like, “Oh, I have this great idea.”

“Okay. What are the sales to back it up?” Right? Nothing. So, the biggest thing is you got to have idea. You got to see if people are willing to pay for it. Once you see, people are willing to pay for it, then you build a system, not vice versa. You don’t go build the system first, spend all this money, and then see, “Okay, cool. Like now let me try it, let me go test the market and see if people will pay for it.” And if people don’t pay for it, guess what? You’re either in debt or you wasted thousands of dollars, or maybe even hundreds of thousands of dollars, depending on what business you’re in. Right? So, that’s my biggest tip. Don’t get into the passive stream, go validate your product, and then build the systems, get cash in the door first because you can’t even build a system without cash.

[33:41] Ellen: Right. Right. And I’m always surprised, but not surprised anymore. Cause I’ve heard it so much, but a lot of times people will come to me and they think they’re going to write a book or they’ve written it and they’re going to publish a book and that’s going to give them passive income right away. And that they then have the money to build what you’re talking about that. And I’ll just say to them that doesn’t work that way. It doesn’t work that way. And I’ll try to help them figure out like do they have something they can consult on? Do they have expertise in something where we can start getting them cashflow right away?

And in those cases, I actually discouraged them from doing the book right away. If that’s how they’re going to use it, because it’s not going to work. When I first started, I did write a book right away. But I used it as a lead generator to get my foot in the door to fill my first group coaching program. So I mean, the object was still coaching, it wasn’t passive book royalties.

Shahrez: Yeah, exactly.

Ellen: Yeah. Because that just doesn’t work. Yeah. So, how can people reach you?

[34:48] Shahrez: Instagram is a great way to reach me; Shahrez Hayder on Instagram. You can send me a message. I check my message requests every single day. I ignore the random, random girls in the DM or in a random spam messages.

Ellen: Yeah. I ignore the ones that tell me they liked my smile or my pretty face,

Shahrez: Yes, we got to focus where we’re out here. It’s a money movement. It’s a business movement. We don’t have time for that type of stuff. But yeah, if you’re going to message me with some value, I’m definitely going to reply. So, you messaged me and you provide value to myself. And that’s the biggest thing. You’re going to message anybody who’s at a high level. And I’m not even saying I’m at the highest level. This is what I had to learn to reach people at a higher level than I am, which there’s always going to be a bigger shark in the ocean. Right?

You got to message them with value. If you’re not providing value first, they’re not going to listen. So provide value, be like, “Hey, like I’ll work for free. Hey, I’ll do this. Hey, I’ll do that.” Right? And that’s, what’s going to get you through the door. If you come in and compliment and like, say all this, like the, the whole kiss-ass type of thing, it’s not going to work. Right? It really doesn’t. I’ve never replied to anybody like that upset. Thanks. And you know, like I’m grateful for it. But if you’re looking for advice, if you’re looking to work with me or even get free advice, really, which I would charge thousands of dollars for, provide value, I’m happy to give it, right? I don’t believe in everything has to be paid for.

Books Open Doors(TM) Insights

[36:08] Ellen: Well, it’s funny that you brought up Instagram and value because today on Books Open Doors Insights, I want to talk about getting started on Clubhouse. So, first a little background. So, I was on a networking call online and I belong to this group, exceptional entrepreneurs. And at the end of the meeting, somebody was asking about Clubhouse. And so, we ended up doing a small breakout session about it. And so, that got me thinking that there are a lot of other people who need this information as well. So, if you’re not familiar with Clubhouse, it’s a relatively new social media platform. It’s an audio only platform. And it’s interactive, which I’ll explain where in a minute about that. But first here’s the deal. So, you have to be on an iPhone or an iPad. And right now, cause it’s kind of still in beta in that sense, they don’t have Android yet.

[36:55]: And anybody can go to the app store though right now and reserve your name. So, you want to go to “joinClubhouse”. And I recommend doing that so that you don’t have to pick another name because your name’s gone later on. So, just go do that. And then you have to be invited to come on. So, you might have a friend or a colleague who has an invite, or you can just ask in social media “Who has an invite to Clubhouse, I’m looking for one” or I want one, whatever. I see people doing that. And then when you get in, you can set the parameters for the topics that you’re interested in. And then you’ll be notified on which conversations are coming up. Those are called rooms. You’ll also want to set up your profile. There’s also, this was a little confusing to me at first there was Clubhouses and there’s Clubhouse.

[37:41]: So, there’s the main site which is called Clubhouse. And then some of the big names are setting up clubhouses within Clubhouse. So, for instance, Steve Olsher, who’s a big podcaster created Club Pod. And then there are a lot of smaller podcasters that have rooms in his pod. So, that’s the deal with that. And then you usually have more than one moderator in a room. You could do it by yourself, but it’s all about collaboration. It’s all about giving value, which is what you were just talking about. And once you get the hang of it, it’s a great way to network by inviting experts who are complimentary to you to be moderators. That’s another way that you can give value to other people that you want to connect with. And then people come to your room at the time that you said you’re going to be live.

[38:25]: You can actually do them on the fly or do them in advance and set them up that way. And then there can be a discussion among the moderators, or it might be a Q and A or sometimes, they’ll go back and they’ll have like some conversation among themselves. And then they’ll say, “Now we’re opening it up to the floor.” And then you can raise your hand and ask a question. And then the more people you follow who are of interest to you, the better. And then when you’re in a room, it’ll say that the moderators are following you. And then that gives you a little more cache. So, there’s kind of like a caste system in there, I’ve noticed. It’s like the moderators at the top. And then there’s the people that the moderators are following. And then there’s people below that.

[39:03]: So if you’re already following people and they see you and follow you back then you’re in a room where it says, they’re following you. Then other people go, “Oh, the speakers are following them. Maybe I should follow them.” So, that’s kind of how that works. And then once you raise your hand to speak, that’s at the right bottom side of the screen and you want to keep yourself muted until it’s your turn to speak. And if you’re in a room, there can be hundreds or thousands of people in a room. And when there are a lot of people, sometimes, your hand can be raised for a really long time. So, there are rooms that are really big and then there are rooms that are smaller. I like the small rooms better for getting into the conversations, unless I know someone who’s one of the moderators.

[39:44]: And cause I know they’re going to let me into, to speak without me having to sit there for hours and hours waiting is that can be really unnerving or sometimes, you know, you’ll feel like, “Oh my God, I can’t wait another hour. I got to go.” Then I feel like I’m being rude because I just have to leave. You know, you can’t sit there any longer. But the big rooms are great when you’re just listening to get value. And some of these really big guys are dropping some amazing value on some of these calls. I’ve gotten some really great information.

Now, the way I got started was I got my feet wet because a colleague invited me right away to moderate a room. And I had no idea what we were doing. So, she set it up and neither one of us had much of a following and we only got one other person to come in the room. And as it turned out, both she and the person who came on were both interested in writing a book. So it worked out for me, but sometimes, , it’s just not worth it until you build up more of a, of a following and more of an understanding of what’s going on in Clubhouse.

[40:39] I really didn’t have a clue. So, I started going into rooms and really just kind of listening, I guess they call it stalking. I was just listening and kind of trying to figure out the, the lay of the land. And then I started participating. I also saw that they have some rooms that are actually for newbies where they’ll explain the rules and kind of how to use it the best way and all that. But next is starting your own room. So, I haven’t gotten to that yet. I’m just getting ready to do that. So, next is starting a room and I’m going to do it without anyone in there, just so I can see how all the buttons work, you know, how everything works, because there’s still some things I’m not quite understanding, cause I haven’t seen it yet.

So, how you invite the moderators on, how you tell people to raise their hand all that sort of thing. And then and then I’ll start inviting you guys into my room when I’m doing some events. And one suggestion that was made was, you could open a room under a bigger room. So, in other words, like if you were a podcaster, you’d want to be in a club and Club Pod under Steve Olsher for instance. But if you’re in a niche where there aren’t any big rooms, then you’re just going to have to work with smaller rooms or just do your own, but then bring moderators in who have big followings. And that can either be on Clubhouse or not on Clubhouse because if they’re going to promote it and they’ve got a big following, then they’ll be driving people to your Cubhouse, to your room. So, that’s the deal with that.

So, the next thing is how do you use Clubhouse to grow your influence and get clients? So first, you want to fill in your profile and make sure to add your picture. And then as you were saying earlier, Clubhouse connects to Instagram, which I find really interesting -that combination. And so, what you want to do is add your Instagram link for sure. And Clubhouse, I wasn’t using Instagram. I was kind of annoyed with Instagram because it was such a hassle to get the stuff over there, having to take it from the computer to the phone, to the iPhone.

[42:31] Ellen: But anyway, but now because the Clubhouse, I got to go in there, so I started doing that. But then what you’ll want to do is connect with people on Clubhouse and then tell them to DM you on Instagram. Just like Shahrez was telling you to do with him. And then continue the conversation there. So remember, if you do that, it’s time to start checking Instagram daily. You can’t just like do that and then ignore it because now people are going to start reaching out to you.

And you can also offer a free gift. So if you aren’t sure how to do your profile, I was on a call last night with some big people. They were saying, “Look at the profiles of other big influencers who are doing well on Clubhouse and model them.” And that’s, one way to go.

[43:13]: But by the way, those who are using it well are getting clients right off a Clubhouse just for showing up, giving value. And I have one friend Sean D. Stewart, who I’ve interviewed on my show before. And I could tell just like I was in a room listening to him and you could just tell he was loving it. He was so getting into it. And like in a week or two, he had 5,000 followers and now it’s like, he’s got over 10,000. So, my bottom line is always do what you enjoy doing. So, I suggest checking it out and then deciding if it’s for you. You may decide, you just want to learn from others on that platform and not really make it one of your prime marketing sites or you may fall in love with it and want to start using it.

[43:56]:  But now is a really good time because we’re all still early adapters and early adapters always get the most out of any marketing strategy. So if you’re on Clubhouse, you can follow me at Ellen Violette, E-L-L-E-N V-I-O-L-E-T-T-E. And then we’ll be able to interact and get to know each other better there. So, I’d love to hear your comments on your experience with Clubhouse and you can put them in the comments on the podcast page. So, do you have anything else to share before we go?

[44:23] Shahrez: Me? Oh yes. No, I’m good. I’m incredibly humble than I really, you having me, Ellen.

Ellen: Oh, it was great to have you. I always learn something. And even though we’re new friends, I feel like we’re going to be friends for a long time. So…

Shahrez: Yes.

Ellen: Yeah, so  that’s it for today to get the transcript go to https://booksopendoors.com/podcast. You’re also welcome to join our Facebook group of visionary speakers and coaches and heart-centered entrepreneurs and authors who want to self-publish and use their book to make a bigger impact, make more money and leave a lasting legacy.

And if you’re ready to write your book, the fast and easy way, you’re welcome to join our waitlist for the next 5 Day Bestseller Breakthrough Challenge coming up at the end of April and that’s www.bestsellerbreakthrough.com. So, the other thing you can do right now is if you’re on the podcast page is grab your own copy of the Book Planner Secrets, if you haven’t already. So, that’s it for now. See you next time. Bye-bye


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About the Author

Ellen Violette

Ellen is an 3X award-winning book, including being named one of the Top 20 Book Coaches of 2022 by Coach Foundation. She's also a multiple #1 bestselling author, a 3-time eLit award winner, podcast host, and a Grammy-nominated songwriter. She has been helping entrepreneurs increase their credibility and expert status, become #1 bestselling authors, and make a bigger impact in the world since 2004. Her mission is to make the world a better place one author and one book at a time!



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